The following transcript has been edited for readability. Timestamps have been removed and minor transcription errors corrected. Speaker comments and context have been preserved.

Opening Remarks

Rich Portelance

Good afternoon, everyone. This is Rich Portelance, and welcome to the EdGate Powers podcast. Today, we're going to be talking to Mindy Fiscus, director of governmental affairs at the Learning Technology Center of Illinois. I'm super excited. This interview goes in tandem with my interview with Jill Pierce, and Mindy and Jill will both be on our upcoming webinar, which is September 10th. There will be a link in the description below, so please sign up for the webinar where we're going to bring these special guests together, and it's going to lead to a heightened conversation. But with Jill, we talked a lot about technology, and with Mindy today, I have a feeling we're going to talk a lot about legislative requirements and how to better meet those if you're an edtech provider or an education publisher. This should be an exciting conversation. Mindy, welcome to the podcast.

Mindy Fiscus

Well, thank you for having me, Rich. I'm happy to be here.

Rich Portelance

Excellent. Can you give everybody a little bit of your background? 

Mindy Fiscus

Sure. So, my name is Mindy Fiscus. I am the director of government affairs for the Learning Technology Center of Illinois (LTC). My title also includes our purchasing cooperative, so I manage that for the state of Illinois as well. The Learning Technology Center of Illinois is the edtech office for our Illinois State Board of Education. So, we do sit right outside the agency. I don't live in Springfield. As a matter of fact, all of our office staff at the LTC work in kind of a hybrid manner. Our offices are housed throughout the state in our educational service centers, and my role with the LTC is to do a lot of fun and cool things. So, I serve as the state E-Rate coordinator for anybody who's involved in the E-Rate process. I call that fun; you might not. That's okay! 

So, I do serve as the state E-Rate coordinator, as well as our advocacy person. So, I talk to our state and national legislators, I try to inform them about what's going on in the state of Illinois and how the changes that they're making at the legislative level impact our schools. In addition to that, I get to do all the cool, fun things. Last week I was at the Illinois State Fair awarding the award for our 3D design. We made 3D butter cows that were passed out in the Governor's Tent for the week. And we also do lots of awards for our office, recognizing the great things that are happening in school districts in our state. So, I get to do all of that. 

I lead the Women In Technology (WIT) group for our community in our state. And in addition to that, I am an avid and active member of SETDA, which is the State Education Technology Directors Association. So, all of the people from all of the states that are helping to be your voice at the national level when it comes to edtech, that's how Jill and I connected and how we know each other. We're both members of SETDA. I serve as the Illinois rep; I was the board chair last year. I'm past chair and treasurer this year. And Jill is one of our affiliate members in SETDA. So, we do a good job trying to connect and not reinvent the wheel, and really kind of learn from each other from state to state, make sure that we're all kind of on the same playing field and can help each other out when necessary. 

So, when I say it all out loud like that, it sounds like a lot, but of course, you know, a lot of it is in the other duties as assigned that I'm sure people see with state directors quite frequently, so… 

Rich Portelance

Oh, well, you know, the enthusiasm comes right through. You can tell you love your job, you love what you do, and that's so important when, you know, it comes to these things, because they can be overwhelming to some people. But you obviously know the landscape better than anybody. 

Discussion

Rich Portelance

You know, kind of a quick aside, we have some things in common, because back when I worked in secondary education, I served on the Connecticut Independent Association of Independent Schools (CAIS) Technology Commission for four years, and had a similar kind of role. I was more on the marketing side, but, you know, I got to meet and be with all these technical people and the directors at the schools, and I learned so much through that experience. 

We were doing on-site audits for schools to understand and help them bring their technology game up to speed, and it was a wonderful learning experience. So, I can have some appreciation for what you do, and how important it is that schools stay abreast of these constant changes, especially with technology. It doesn't slow down, does it?

Mindy Fiscus

It really doesn't. And it's really nice that you put it that way because there's a “me” in every state in our nation. So, every state has a person who is out there looking out for schools and trying to connect schools with the best resources, etc. But, it looks different in every state. And so, it's one of the things that we really talk about a lot in our SETDA conversations is, “Well, that works in our state, but it doesn't work in that one.” And so, I will try to provide context, not just for how things work in Illinois–we're our own special kind of animal–but how that might work or look in other states, as well, as we talk today.

Rich Portelance

Yeah, I was going to say, that's a wonderful starting point, because as everybody knows, you know, federally, things are disrupted right now; every state is operating in a very independent manner. And if you're an edtech provider or an edtech publisher, you're trying to focus in and win contracts, but you have to understand each state independently, know how to do it, and figure out which pieces can be, you know, templated over each state, but there are a lot of differences. So, can you talk a little bit about that and what you're seeing in that landscape? 

Mindy Fiscus

So… and that's the thing I think a lot of times when I'm talking to people, especially about the procurement side of things, they automatically assume that every state is willing or able to do, like, a group purchase for everybody in the state. And what I found is there are a couple, there are a couple states that still do that top-down rollout, and they found that the most efficient, and their school districts appreciate that practice, but there are many more of us that are kind of a grassroots effort. And so, in some states, if the state board says, "Hey, this is the greatest thing ever. We bought it for you", it just won't get used because of the context that we're providing it to you. In other states, you know, that's the way they work.

So, in our state of Illinois, we've tried to create organizations and conversations around procurement and tools to where if you were to call the State Board of Education today, and you were to talk to somebody about wanting to do a group purchase, you're literally going to be told, “We don't do that in the state of Illinois. But, hey, why don't you come out here and talk to Mindy, Hope, and Amanda at ILTPP (Illinois Learning Technology Purchase Program)”, which is our procurement mechanism. And what we do is kind of sign on vendor partners, and then say to our partner schools, which is every school in the state of Illinois, there are 851 this year, “This is a negotiated price or an offering that we can do for you.” Right? So instead of purchasing for all school districts to make their own decisions, we call that from the state perspective. We say, “Hey, this is the freedom of our schools to choose. We are a free choice state”, and so many of the states will say that, but it varies from state to state. 

So, in some instances, some states will procure a student management system for everybody in the state, and that is what you must use. And in other states like ours, everybody gets to use their own, as long as their system can generate that report back up to the state board of education. 

When it comes to tools, it also gets a little interesting from state to state, as well, because we have some student data privacy laws from the national level that push down, but more so in this new environment where all the states are making their own decisions like you said before, a lot of states have come up with their own student data privacy, what counts, what doesn't count, what you have to have in your agreements, and everybody has to have agreements or not. In our state, we use the Student Data Privacy Consortium (SPDC). It's a national organization that you can participate in. And the benefit of that for us is that if a school district in our state signs an agreement that is authorized by that SPDC, then everybody else in the state can piggyback off of that agreement. So, if you get one school district in the state, and it does not have to be Chicago Public, because that's the hardest to work through the channels. But if you get one of our school districts in our state, and it happens to be maybe one of our collar county districts, or a central Illinois district even, the other school districts can come out, and they can say, "Oh, good. We already have the student data privacy agreement taken care of here. We can check that off our list." Because that is the biggest thing that's coming up now as the new state laws are pushing out. Between that and accessibility standards in states, adapting to that, and accepting those individual state laws on that. Once you kind of get a blueprint, I'll say, and a contract or an agreement, then everybody else can just copy that blueprint. 

It's been really successful here, and I know that it's worked in other states, like Nebraska and Utah, as well.

Rich Portelance

Okay, fantastic. So, the accessibility standards is something that Jill mentioned as well. You know, can you give us kind of a quick outline of what that is in Illinois and what people are looking for?

Mindy Fiscus

So, I think really what they're looking for is that all students can have access to the tools without there being additional, added features or programs that they have to purchase to access it. A lot of what we're looking and focusing on right now is even for our state websites and our resources, like at the Learning Technology Center, making sure that they are all accessible, that you can access them on any kind of device–mobile as well as online–and just making sure everybody can see, read, and/or be read to the material that is there. So, sometimes that is the automation of making it, you know, so that the systems can read the text that's on the screen. Sometimes for our dyslexic kids, that's being able to invert or reverse the black and white colors. So, like, some of our kids need it to be on a black background with white letters, instead of a white background with black letters, and those kinds of things. 

There is a national goal that everybody's trying to get to, and I think that we have, if I'm correct, we have until 2026 at some point to make sure that we are all meeting that objective, but every state's doing it a little bit differently in each way. So, some states will have, like, a “You must know that this board, or this council, or whatever, you know, is going to review and look at that.” I think most of the states are coming from kind of a grassroots sort of thing where we're like, “This is one of the things you need to check off your box. Like, you need to make sure that you have asked questions about accessibility, that you've reviewed it for that”, as well as you've reviewed it for that student data privacy piece that I was talking about. And then you just have to be able to demonstrate that you did, and/or if there are any concerns about a product, that you have a policy and a procedure for how you're going to address those, and that you follow that policy or procedure.

Rich Portelance

Okay. All right. That's really helpful. You talked a little bit about, you know, a freedom of choice for your schools in selecting technology, whether it's an LMS (Learning Management System) or something else. Are you– is your group vetting, reviewing, and making sure that whatever is chosen–before it gets chosen–you put it in a pool and say, “Okay, we've done all the work, these are all approved”, and then they can choose? Or is it– how does that process go? 

Mindy Fiscus

We are not. So, that is not something that we are doing in our state. I think some states do have some initiatives. Most of those that I've seen operate around their OER, their open educational resources, and they're vetting them to make sure that they are of a certain quality or standard. We are not in our state. One of the things that we do is that we say, “You know, it's the school district's choice to choose what programming they're using.” One of the things that we've seen kind of a national trend on, though, is that school districts are starting to have to be more transparent about the tools that they do have and what those tools are. Some states are even requiring teachers to provide lesson plans, tools, books, and things that they're using for that course, or that content for the year. That's not something that we're doing in Illinois. Like, again, I joke because one of my other state counterparts is like, "Yes, but in Illinois it's the wild, wild west." And I was like, "Right, everybody gets to do what they want!" But we do– there's not, like, a stamp of approval. 

That's not to say that there are not some resources that state funds are used for in particular that have to go through a process. So, we do have professional learning for teachers that people have to get approved to be a professional learning provider. So, you either have to have approval from our state board of education, or work with an entity that does provide professional learning. Same thing for some of the content. So, we have online courses for some of our students. Sometimes those are credit recovery, sometimes that's a course that's not offered by the school district, etc. Those, if you're using that particular– we call it our Illinois Virtual School funding. So, if you're using that Virtual School funding, you have a catalog that you choose from for those kinds of course content, and things like that. 

Right now, our focus is more on making sure that we have quality content in the classroom itself. But the tool, the resource, and the content that you're using or where you're curating that from is totally up to the school district. So, we see some school districts that have the funds and have decided to kind of shift and invest their money on online resources and stuff, while some schools are still focusing on that, you know, traditional textbook content and the digital resources that come with that textbook content. 

Rich Portelance

Yeah.

Mindy Fiscus

But we don't… we're of the opinion in our state of Illinois, we don't want to be the master of “you can and can't”. It’s a “you just have to answer questions if we ask” kind of situation. 

Rich Portelance

Okay. So, if I'm trying to sell into a school district, and I have content that has to meet specific standards, let's say it's, you know, I have an English language learning tool. I have to meet the K-12 learning requirements that are there in the standards. Plus, I have to meet whatever legislative components that you guys put in there, right? What is that? What are the steps?

Mindy Fiscus

Here's first the secret: many of the state standards are very, very similar, right? So, we might stick an “I” on the front of it, and we'll call it Illinois standards, but they might match exactly to a neighboring state or a state somewhere else in the union. So, many of the standards are very, very similar. 

I think when it comes to the standards, as long as you can say, "Hey, we align with this set of standards”, there are those crosswalks and there are those papers in the background that each individual state is used to the schools using to say, “Okay, if you align with the Common Core standards, then you're going to align with the Illinois learning standards." So, that's the first thing. Just be upfront and honest, like, “This is what we align with, hey, you know, how can we check that box?” 

The other thing is, I feel like most of the programs that we're dealing with do have those alignments, but they're trying to cater to it. There's no reason for a provider to have to do things 50 different ways. If you can just say, "This is what we align to, and where's the information to see that crosswalk, or for us to demonstrate that we also align to your particular state standard", is the key there. Like, let's not reinvent the wheel. And again, that's one of the benefits of working with SETDA, because if I hear that there's another state using that particular program, that gives me some leverage here in the state to –if there are some concerns or something to push through, we can be like, “Hey, if you meet California's student data privacy, you're likely going to meet Illinois student data privacy”, right? There are some of us that have a higher level, and you're going to run across some states that are like, “Hey, they're still working on the legislation for that. Like, we don't have an overall, you know, ‘here's what you have to meet document’ at this point”, it's still in the works. But it really is mostly that you're just willing to bend and weave and answer the questions when they come your way. But they're not dramatically different from state to state. 

I mean, that was one of the benefits of us moving to the Common Core standards a few years ago. Many of the states, another word to know, is many of the states use… we have endorsed. So there's a difference between endorsed and adopted. In a lot of states, if you go through adoption, it takes several hearings, a certain board has to answer it a certain way, it has to go in front of a committee–maybe it's even legislatively driven–to adopt a standard set, where endorsing a standard set means, like, we're of the same mindset, but we don't want to go through that whole process of doing all of that. So, we're going to endorse these certain kinds of standards. And for our state, like the ISTE standards for technology integration, that's something that we have endorsed, but they didn't go through the whole process of going through the formalized adoption. And I'm starting to see the benefits of that, because as they change, they update, and they do renditions, if you are endorsing, you don't have– there's not a whole other red tape process before, so people can consistently use the tools and those standards moving forward.

Rich Portelance

I could imagine that edtech providers would like to hear that you're cutting away some of the red tape, you know, from any state perspective, because it's so arduous today to service 50 different states in 50 different ways. So, congratulations, you probably won some friends!

Mindy Fiscus

I think that the biggest question that I get– though I really appreciate the conversation around the standards, the approval, and all of that. The real thing that I get a lot is, “And how do I get in front of your schools? Like, what does that approach look like?” And that is what is dramatically different from state to state, right? Like, you can look at that approval piece as pretty consistent. You just need to have the, you know, go through the right process. The “how do I get in front of the schools in your state” can be dramatically different from state to state. 

So, for example, we say in our state, the key is to find some winners. Like, if you can go out and you can find a large, medium, and small district in my state, and you can get them to be your cheerleaders, use your product, and be advocates for you. And the best approach in our state in particular is if they’re going to conferences with you, and the school district presents, “Hey, we're doing this wonderful thing and this is the tool that we're using”, that goes a really long way with the peer pressure mentality of our state, right? So, more so than just getting into a vendor area at a conference, etc., not that that's not beneficial, but it is really the testimonials of the school districts that are using the product and saying, "Hey, my neighbor’s using this”. Or when this superintendent says to that superintendent at a meeting, “Yeah, we just invested in such and such. We're getting this, this, and this back from it." I think that's kind of something that's been interesting the last couple of years, is the ability to say “It's making a difference and this is how we see it”. 

So, the tools that have that piece on the back end that allow you to kind of assess and say, “Hey, we've used this at these grade levels, our scores have improved”, a reporting mechanism to say these teachers are using it and these teachers are not, right? From an administrative level to kind of track and see the difference that it makes, is really having more of a voice lately. It used to be just all peer pressure, fear of missing out, and I want to have what my neighbor has. But now, people are like, “Yes, but what's that done for your reading scores?” Or “What has that done for your management of the classroom?” Or whatever that tool is supposed to do. 

And so, show your work is what one of my teacher friends says. It's back to high school math. If our vendors can show their work and can say, like, “These are the five teachers that used it, this pilot, of this particular school, this is the difference that it made for them, and these are the great things that they have to say about it”, that not only speaks to the district adopting it as a whole, but also to the neighboring districts to say, "Hey, I want to give this a shot." 

Rich Portelance

Okay, that's fantastic information, and I'm sure any edtech provider listening will get a lot out of that in trying to bring their product forward. I do want to ask you a little bit about CTE and how things are changing in Illinois, but I just want to remind everybody that on September 10th, Mindy will be on our podcast, and we're going to be talking with Jill Pierce as well. We're going to be covering some of these topics and more, so we invite you to click the link below and make sure you sign up for that. 

So, you know, we're dealing with an uptick in a surge of requests for CTE to be added into our library. We're seeing a lot of vendors starting to scramble to build products around that. What are you seeing at the state level? What are the requirements, and, you know, what are the schools– 

Mindy Fiscus

Let me give you a little background on why I think that is. Of course, we have a national conversation about the importance of career readiness. And we're seeing, in my opinion, a big movement towards career pathways, and the importance of those career pathways in addition to those college pathways. And so, there's a big interest in that. I think our guidance counselors across the state and the nation are becoming more and more aware of what the workforce wants. 

Career and technical education (CTE) funding is really interesting. So, federal funding comes in and is offered to a state, and then the state matches it to receive it. So, for the state of Illinois, I think it's something like, $40 million is available, but the state has to invest for $40 million, and as a return, you now have $80 million available for career educational technology funding. 

In our state, and I think in a lot of states, that's funneled down through kind of a way where school districts offer certain courses. They might offer those courses just in the school district itself, they might offer them in like a vocational cooperative, where multiple school districts have gotten together to offer those kinds of career ed tech courses, they might offer them in partnership with community colleges, and we're seeing a lot of that across our state. Partnerships in such a way that those students who are high school students in junior or senior year might be taking a welding course at the local community college with, you know, freshmen and sophomores in college, to work towards a certificate or a degree program while they're still in high school. We call that “dual credit” in our state. So, a lot of different movements on the career ed tech motions, but also career and technical education covers everything from home economics courses, to business courses, to cybersecurity courses for students that they can take, get credit, and move towards even college pathways in those fields, as well. But a lot of interest from our local businesses investing in programs that will feed their needs for workers. So I happen to live in a community–it's our one claim to fame–we make the Heath candy bar. So, the Heath candy bar was made here in Robinson, Illinois. That's where it started. Our company, that was The Heath Company, was sold to another company, and then to Hershey over the years. We are the only place that makes the Heath candy bar. So, when we are here in our community, there is a focus on what kind of traits, trends, and things we are seeing that they need for their workers to keep that factory open and to keep that Heath candy bar here, because that was part of the agreement when selling to Hershey. 

And I think we see that in all kinds of different communities. We're also the home here to Caterpillar, Inc. in Illinois, and so we have a lot of that, and State Farm and insurance companies in the Bloomington area. So every community has a little bit of a different slant and focus on what they need for their workers, and you see that reflected in the kinds of courses and offerings that are offered in the schools and communities around them.

Rich Portelance

Oh, that's… it's a fascinating area, you know, connecting with those employers and how they are driving requirements back to educators and back to, you know, the ultimate creation of a standard so that the skills can be developed to get these students ready to go into a factory or to work at Caterpillar, you know, whatever it is. I think that the whole field is not only blossoming, but it's good that it's developing, because, you know, not every kid is going to be going to college, nor should they. You know, I would imagine we probably overemphasized it. Maybe now it's a course correction, but it sounds like Illinois is on top of that. Are you seeing a lot of the providers starting to build tools specifically around that? Or is that…? 

Mindy Fiscus

Great question. So I see some providers who are putting in new modules or tools for those elements. We're starting to see some really interesting things come out that didn't exist, right? So, there was one that that somebody was talking about the other day, and I wish I could remember the name of the company, but it was like a virtual reality scenario for high schools–specifically geared towards those guidance offices–where you could put on this virtual reality headset, see different careers, physically be in those spaces, and see if that was kind of your thing. And it was a career exploration tool. I don't know that that's something that we would have seen five years ago without, of course, virtual reality, and the push into career and technical education. And if you– if that's not the right fit for you, if college is not the right pathway or fit for you, what might be? For example, I have one child who is going to be a teacher and is in college, and my other child is taking his first building trades class this morning on the first day of junior year, where they literally go out and build a house as part of those things. 

Rich Portelance

You know, that's fantastic to hear. You know, these things are now an application, that students have these opportunities to go out there and understand what it is. You know, picking up the hammer, or, you know, putting a roof in place. There's no better way to understand a trade rather than to do it for a little while. And so, I'm happy to hear that your son's taking advantage of that. 

Mindy Fiscus

Well, and there are only so many businesses that will risk hiring some summer employees in construction, etc., that are teenagers. Do you know what I mean? So, there's only so many people that have that hands-on experience in their summer or after-school jobs to be able to really see if that's a fit for them. We also have a great welding program at our community college in partnership. We have a program at our community college which is kind of unique I think to our area where they do fiber boring, laying, termination of fiber, and technology on the aspect of, like, broadband, and rolling that out. So, it's interesting to see that that's a result of, you know, different investments and partnerships that our community has in those broadband initiatives that have happened in our state and across the nation.

We have a need for people to go out and be able to lay fiber, get those broadband projects up and going, make sure that it can get to their homes, and that people can access the internet. So, as we have worked, especially from my E-Rate hat on that side of things, in funding school districts’ technology and access to the internet, we're now finding this big push to move into the community for that access and that internet. 

And so, there's a lot of different funding– a lot of different groups working on how do we fund that? What does that look like? How do we get that internet to the homes? And maybe that's career and technical education pathways, like that's one support. But also, what other funding sources or resources do we have to get internet access to that rural farm that was willing to pay the monthly rate, but just can't get somebody to get it to them. And so, it's been really interesting to watch that process over the last couple of years, as well.

Rich Portelance

And now is that something that's E-Rate fundable if I'm laying fiber and trying to get people access?

Mindy Fiscus

It depends. You have to be a little creative. So, E-Rate funds schools and libraries. We use it to fund schools and libraries, but if we can convince them to go connect that rural school that's in the middle of a rural community, and we can get to that school, then if the provider is innovative, then they also see that as an opportunity to connect to the homes of that rural school in that same circumstance. 

And so, it's just interesting when you kind of talk about the broadband commerce side of things with the broadband funding side of things. There have been a couple of initiatives through the stimulus funding that we saw that did provide access to homes, and now there's kind of a scale back on, “Okay, we're done with COVID”, right? And so, you're learning back in physical school buildings, but there's a big bunch of us that still believe that connectivity at home is still important. Those kids still need to be able to do that “homework”, if you want to call it the homework gap. 

And there are many, many times that we have times that school students in schools need access at home to do projects, to work on snow days, or if they have other initiatives, or maybe that student is injured and homebound. And so, there's a higher level of awareness now, I think after COVID, about the importance of connecting people wherever they are instead of just at school.

Rich Portelance

Yeah. No, that makes sense. And I'm curious, kind of taking the next step in terms of what's happening from a technology standpoint, AI is coming in. It's making huge inroads and helping students to do work, helping teachers to set lesson plans. There's a lot of good that's happening, but I'm sure there are some requirements and regs that are coming down from Illinois and other states. What are you seeing in that regard? 

Mindy Fiscus

So, I think that the last check– I think there were, like, 32 states that have now adopted some kind of AI guidance of what you should do or know to do in that particular state when it comes to AI in the state and in education in particular. One of the things that we're really focused on in our organization, we offer professional learning for teachers on multiple levels. So whether that's coaching in the classroom, to whether that's, you know, school-based training, to regional-based training, and conferences, our big push and our big understanding over the last couple of years is: let's not be as scared of this new tool, AI, right? So, we're talking about AI, the benefits that it can have, really talking to school districts about not just, like, shutting the door and blocking things. I think we can learn from any high school classroom that if you block something, they will find a way around it. So how can you deal with this new technology that is in front of you? 

And as one teacher said to me, “It's no different than the math classrooms of the late 90s that we when we said, ‘We're going to ban calculators’, like, that you're never going to have a calculator in your pocket every hour of the day, and now we do.” So, it's, you know, it's one of those tools that we can't hide from, and we need to embrace, and I think that most of the state guidelines that I've seen so far are finding ways to do that. 

So, finding ways to accept and adapt and allow innovation, but also giving the onus back to the school districts to have that local control, and to say, “This is what we're going to allow or not allow in these particular grades in our school district”. Which maybe is not a one-size-fits-all solution that I think you were maybe hoping for, but it is saying that I think that we're being open-minded, that we're embracing AI as a resource, but we're also going to be cognizant of the fact that students are going to try to use it to communicate with each other and cheat, and how can we educate them on the ways that they can use it most effectively. 

In my opinion, the best way that we're doing that with our teachers is showing our teachers and administrators how they might use AI to do their jobs better, how they can use it for lesson plan development, how they can use it for differentiating learning in their classrooms, how they can use it for even scheduling, planning, and getting together their parent teacher conference schedule, or the administrators automating messages that are going out to their staff, communicating with parents, and things like that. And so, breaking down that barrier of fear is the first step. 

And like I said, most state policies are saying, “This is something we're aware of. This is something we're embracing.” But at the same time, it's exponentially growing. And so, there's a little bit of a concern or a scare there. 

And we're all going to have school districts that go from, like, the most scared school district in one part of the state that's blocking everything they can, to the most open school district in another part of the state. And it's funny when you have, like, state and national conferences, and you hear teachers say to each other, "Oh, there's no way my administrator would let me do that", you know? So, you're going to have that variance of comfort.

Rich Portelance

Yeah. No, it makes a lot of sense. And I, you know, I'm not advocating for one way or another. I’m just trying to provide the information, right? We're here just trying to let people know what's going on, and, you know, it's… I think you have to, you know, everybody has to make an assessment about what they want to do. And, you know, over time it'll become more ubiquitous and it'll open up, but some people tend to be more conservative than others, and you know, that's all fine. But on the other hand, when you talk about another technology like cybersecurity, I would imagine there you have some more overarching principles that people have, right? 

Mindy Fiscus

Yeah. And on the cybersecurity front, it's not really an option at this point. Like, we are a target. We know that we're a target. People can access our data and education, and that's a scary thing. Like, there's a lot of very rich and hijackable data that we have in our school districts. And so, cybersecurity is one of those things that… this sounds so terrible, I feel bad saying it. It's not so much if as in when, and do you have your doors closed and locked? And unfortunately, I think a lot of our school districts have their doors wide open, or their doors closed, and those locks aren't in place, and they don't even know it. And so, when it comes to cybersecurity, I think that is something that we are going to see as we shift away from the home access conversation.

The resources that people were trying to put towards that, they will be putting towards cybersecurity in the future. We do have a pilot; it's not exact– I call it E-Rate adjacent. There is an FCC pilot for cybersecurity; $200 million, which was not nearly enough, and 800 different entities across the state that are being piloted over the next three years to kind of see what that cybersecurity funding could do and what it should look like. And so, I look at it like a research project. 

Out of the school districts, libraries, and other entities that were chosen, how did they decide to spend the funds that were allocated to them? What kinds of services did they decide to influence with that? And what we will be able to provide back to the FCC is these are the types of most common needs that school districts have when it comes to cybersecurity. Here's the most common needs, and here's what it costs. And then they will have all the information at their disposal to decide, okay, there's no way that a single system like the FCC is going to be able to fund all of our cybersecurity needs. It's just not something that they have at their disposal. But what would that look like in a legislative ask? How much money do we ask for as a bucket of funding for that? What could that do? 

I don't think it's meant to be the end-all, but I think their intention is to kind of move that forward to say, “How can we provide at least a start to all of the schools and libraries in the state to protect at a basic level, if not an advanced level? If the school district's already done the first several steps, what's the next step for them?” And meet school districts where they are and support them with a little bit of funding. 

So, that'll be interesting to watch, as all funding that comes from the federal government comes out, it's always an interesting thing to kind of– it's a slow process to kind of see how that application process works with all those checks and balances to make sure everybody's doing right by the federal funds that are coming to them. And then, what's the end result, and what are we finding? I think the voices have been heard loud and clear that cybersecurity is an issue that we need to address and that we want to address. It gets at the top of every survey that I've seen when it comes to edtech in the last three years. 

So, we'll see as we gather the data what that looks like. Unfortunately, every day I hear of another school district that, you know, has a ransomware attack, or found out that, you know, their data was– 

Rich Portelance

Compromised?

Mindy Fiscus

–hijacked in some way, right? Compromised is the right word. Thank you for that. So, you know, we'll do our best to button down the roofs and to tell people that just simply putting together a policy is kind of where we are with a lot of districts. Like, what do you have in place and what would you do if you found out somebody called tomorrow and said, “We have your student data, we want this much money for it.” Like, what does that look like? What kind of policies would you put into place to where you know what to do, and how to bring your district back up to speed?

A local district here a couple years ago, it was like an uproar, because they had a ransomware attack situation, and everybody was like, “Why are we not having school for these three days of this week in the middle of January?” Well, it's because those same systems that run those computers are also running the HVAC system, are also running the security systems, or, like, I think it was an “aha” moment for that particular community to realize how much is online and how much school districts are doing and providing in an electronic way. It's not just about the Chromebooks that the kids were walking around with; it's about the whole infrastructure that's all managed with electronics these days.

Rich Portelance

It is. I think that's a really good point. So much is managed online that, you know, understanding what your infrastructure is, being able to manage it, understanding policies, is really important information to get hold of, and have someone who can be able to communicate when something happens very quickly and efficiently. Without that, you know, you really can be at the mercy of these nefarious individuals, and just unfortunately, that's what's out there. So, yeah. 

Mindy Fiscus

We have an event for tech directors, primarily, that audience and administrators, I suppose, that we call SecurED Schools. That's a virtual conference that we have every January. And we focus on some of those federal programs like PTAC (U.S. Department of Education's Privacy Technical Assistance Center), etc., that offer, like, here's a playbook for how you might build a policy for cybersecurity needs in your district, here's a tabletop exercise; this happened, you got this phone call, what are you going to do next? And those kinds of things. 

And so, we're trying to arm our tech directors with the information that they need to start the conversation, and trying to inform our administrators that it's not a tech problem; cybersecurity is an administrative problem, and tech needs to be at the table, but so did the superintendent and the principals of those buildings, to know who's doing what and when. It's an emergency planning process, not just a tech process. So, it's a big conversation.

Rich Portelance

Big. Exactly. A big conversation. Just a reminder, September 20th, we're going to be doing this webinar. Mindy will be back, and I'm sure we're going to get a lot more unbelievably great information. 

Mindy, just to change the topic slightly, and I know we're getting short on time, but I wanted to touch on trends. What are you seeing being adopted these days? What are schools looking for, and what's kind of coming in the door that might surprise, you know, our audience?

Mindy Fiscus

Well, we did talk about cybersecurity, and we did talk about CTE, which I think are both big national trends. I think what we're seeing a little bit more, and it's going to be interesting to watch, is a bigger use of creativity tools, a bigger use of individualized learning, the ability for students to communicate and report in different ways, and teachers–finally because of AI–adapting and opening their ideas to, like, all my kids don't have to write this report in this way, or do this particular PowerPoint in this fashion, but how would you like to share the content back with me? And what does that look like for you? 

Whether that's creating artwork, or whether that's creating a movie, or whether that's using some of the STEM tools that you have, we have a big push in our state and in multiple states that we're partnering with for coding, and how coding is the next, you know, as far as we're concerned, the next language that everybody is going to need to know and have, and AI really does assist with that. 

And you might not have the masters of coding that we've seen in the past, there's a shift in that movement as well, but knowing and understanding the information that is in front of you, how to synthesize that, and how to share that back out, so that it is not in such a way that you're just ingesting all the time, but you're actually creating. 

And I know there have been companies that have been on board with that initiative for years and years. I think we're going to start to see some momentum for– and part of that is led from the home, for parents who are wanting to see what their kids are learning, from an education at a national level who needs to defend themselves and say, "Wait, we are doing some good things here, and here's our stories." 

And so, I think through steam and and innovative ways of showing delivery, that we're going to find a lot more project-based learning, a lot more community-based projects, and a lot more creative ways of students being able to share not just what they're learning with their classroom and their teacher, but share it with their community and with the world. So, it's going to be fun to watch.

Rich Portelance

I love that. Not only your answer, but kind of where that's going, because allowing the students to be creative in the way that they think, I think that's going to be– that's going to open so many doors. You know, being forced to do things and deliver in a specific way, if that's not the way you think, we all know that, you know, individualized learning is really critical, and providing tools for that and letting kids start to express themselves in natural ways is going to be, I think, a revolutionary thing for our school districts and for the future of this country.

Mindy Fiscus

Yeah. And doing so in a safe manner, right?

Rich Portelance

Yeah.

Mindy Fiscus

Having real conversations about, “Where did you get that data?”, “Did you get that from three sources?”, and “What were those sources?” And having those conversations about where did that information come from, but also not sharing too much about the student, right? Making sure they're protected and their interface and the tools that they're using in the classroom are safe and secure for them until they're ready to share that. And what does that look like sharing it out, and does it have any, you know, personally identifiable information that would be, you know, a concern on our student data privacy side of things? So, it's a balance, and it's finding the right ways to do it the right way. 

And like, I go back to, you know, the fear of missing out in the school district. Once a school district figures out what that looks like, and once they have a student group that's maybe doing an enterprise center, building their own businesses, and sharing that out with people, or whether a school district goes out and offers website building and tech support for their local businesses, etc., when that happens in the school district about a half an hour from you, then your superintendent hears about it, they want to offer those kind of programs, too. 

And so, I think it's going to be really interesting to watch the next iteration of what, in particular, middle school and high school students are doing, how they're learning, and how that's different from what we had back in the 90s or even before. I remember having our first computer lab. It dates me, right? But looking at our first computer lab and then knowing my son's going to his first day of junior year today, where they'll hand him his Chromebook that he has not learned without since sixth grade, right? It's just a whole new world, and they're doing new and different things, and it's fun to watch.

Rich Portelance

It is fun to watch. 

Closing Thoughts

Rich Portelance

Well, Mindy, clearly you and I can go on like this for hours and hours. We do have to close it out, so I want to thank you for your time today and provide a last opportunity. Is there anything that we missed or anything that you want to sign off with that you think is valuable that we might not have covered today?

Mindy Fiscus

As my pre-K teacher mother would say, “It's time for us to use our words”. So, it's time for us to tell our stories and use our words, especially having the voice of the vendor perspective when we do our advocacy days on the hill. Whether that's national or whether that's local in your state. Having those vendor partners there at those advocacy events to say, “This is important not just from the perspective of schools, but also from the perspective of the industry that we're in.” Please use your words, please use your stories, connect with school districts, partner with them, bring your voices to the table when we do advocacy events, because it's always really good for them to hear what's going on in the schools, but really, really good for them to hear and how that's impacting the greater community through our vendor partners that we're working with. So, if given the opportunity, even if you're not comfortable with it, join an advocacy day, join an outreach, show up to a showcase day to see what a school is doing, and elevate their voices, because sometimes we do great things–we just don't know how to tell that story. So, help us to tell their stories.

Rich Portelance

What a great way to sign off. That's a wonderful invitation. Mindy, I thank you for your time today, and I look forward to talking to you in a couple of weeks on our webinar.

Mindy Fiscus

All right. Thank you, Rich! 

Rich Portelance

Thank you